Cloud Crunch
Cloud Crunch

Episode · 1 year ago

S2E07: CXO Considerations: Multi-Cloud - Is it Really Worth It?


The promise of multi-cloud suggests enterprises should be able to run their applications and workloads in whichever cloud environment makes the most sense from a cost, performance or functionality perspective. But the reality of the situation can be very different in practice, as enterprises grapple with how best to make technologies created by competing suppliers play nicely together. Contributor and Analyst to Forbes, CBS interactive, Information Today, Inc., and RTInsights, Joseph McKendrick, joins today’s episode to give his perspective on the value of a multi-cloud strategy.

...involve Solve, evolve, Welcome to cloud Crunch, the podcast for any large enterprise planning on moving to or is in the midst of moving to the cloud hosted by the cloud computing experts from Second Watch, Ian will be chief architect Cloud Solutions and Skip Berry, executive director of Cloud Enablement. And now here are your hosts of Cloud Crunch. Welcome back to Cloud crunch. Today I am joined by my co host, Skip Barry. Skip. Good afternoon. Good afternoon to you and we have a special guest today. Joe McKendrick. Welcome, Joe. Thank you. Great to be here. I look forward Thio enlightening session and maybe I'll provide someone like Man who knows, uh to introduce Joe here. He's a contributing analyst to Forbes, CBS Interactive Information Today Inc and Artie insights dot com. He's also an author, independent researcher, speaker exploring innovation, information technology, trends and markets. He's a regular contributor to Forbes and ZD Net as well. Much of his research work is a conjunction with Forbes insights and information today covering topics such as cloud computing, digital transformation, artificial intelligence, Big Data Analytics. He is a co author of the S O, a manifesto which outlines the values and guiding principles of service orientation in business. And I t All right, well, I mean, Joe, that's quite a background that you have there. Quite impressive. Yeah. Today you know, we're going to talk about some of the promise of multi cloud kind of strategies. It suggests that enterprises should be able to run their applications and workloads and whatever cloud environment makes the most sense from a cost and performance off course functionality, perspective at the moment in time. So, in theory, that's how multi cloud is supposed to work. But the reality of the situation could be a very different in practice. As we all know, a Z Enterprises grapple with how to best make technologies created by competing suppliers play nicely together. I want to hear more about that, of course. So let's let's kind of dive into this, Joe, you know, again, thanks for being on our show. And I think we're going to get some great insights idea today. Yeah. Hey, I'm super excited around. This is well coming from my former background. All all cloud on Prem to hear now, working for, uh, you know, cloud native Company. So, Joe Ah, good place to dive in. Give us the contrast. Yngve you, if you would, from application developer Thio i t centric infrastructure view, if you could, how that's evolved and where that actually stands today in Realm of Hybrid Club. Well, interestingly, I think from the perspective of application developers, you know the move to cloud doesn't change a whole lot in terms of the structure of their jobs. And the structure of what they need to do is simply a for lack of a better way to put a change of venue rather than applications systems functionality. Residing in the same building in the data center, it's been moved out. It's been shifted outward to Amazon Web services and Microsoft Azure, Google Cloud or whatever. It's been most optimal. Yeah, so if they're already doing some sort of agile or what have you, they wouldn't barely noticed any difference exactly. Exactly. There's that first move. You know that first migration, if you will, and often it's It's seen as, ah, cost saving measure. You know you're moving from the cap ex to the op X type of model. You know you're going to a monthly subscription plan, but as things move along. That's where you begin to get some, uh, Now, sometimes some surprises, uh, in other ways their eyes begin to open up a little bit. Mawr there's there's more potential for different types of applications. More robust applications, uh, new types of applications, new types of innovation when this happens further on down the road as Cloud introduces its...

...flexibility, Um, there's some often some I don't know if you call nasty surprises or some unexpected surprises in terms of cost. You know, you're going to a monthly subscription model and everybody begins to log on and start using these services. And next thing you know, you're getting bills. These humongous bills from your cloud provider that match the cost of buying the equipment in the first place, right? We thought PM sprawl was bad, let alone. Now you have cloud spend sprawl. Yeah, yeah, there's some kind of law I can't think the exact name of the law. You know, it just this. When you build an expressway out into a rural area, you think it's gonna help reduce traffic congestion. But that expressway creates shopping centers and all kinds of sprawl along that stretch, so that eventually becomes clogged anyway. Yeah, there's a name for it. I forget what it is. They are some kind of Murphy's law way. See that in Atlanta all the time. We expand the highways and they get more congested. So just slowing down. Exactly. Exactly. That's how it works with you know, you have. You know, this this great functionality with cloud. And everybody starts building along this route this cloud route that you've established and, uh, that becomes clogged. And, you know, the cost began to accelerate as well. So similar toe urban sprawl. We have cloud sprawls we've touched on and then managing multiple clouds obviously creates a lot of complexity for the organization. What are some of the areas that can help that you've seen out there as far as the management and even looking at operating systems and then different expertise that in industry or an enterprise needs to cultivate thio prevent these types of things? Well, that Z, that's a tough question. The answer, because, you know, the cloud providers themselves provide some pretty decent tooling to help monitor and manage what you're doing with their services. There's, uh, there's a lot of great monitoring and management tools. But when we didn't talk about multi cloud or hybrid cloud, even you have these different environments and you're attempting to manage and monitor various different types of environments and that becomes, ah, challenge. It becomes a real challenge to ah so I departments and, uh, as well, I think you see, the failing of adoption happened. There is. It's the If the mindset doesn't evolve right, the technology evolves and the platforms evolve. And then if the, you know human aspect doesn't come along, This is where we see a lot of folks failing, right? Exactly. Exactly. And and we saw it in the on premises. I t world as well. You know, you had a point where you had many different operating systems. For example, in environment you had, you know, I'm gonna date myself here. But if you look back in the nineties, you know you had eunuchs. You have these unique server farms. You had windows come into the picture, you saw mainframes. And these all require different forms of expertise. There's a different tools to monitor these different environments. There is the challenge of attempting to integrate, be able to move data between these environments. And to some extent we're seeing that with these various cloud environments that are on the picture as well. You know where the technology is? A little more integrate herbal, shall we say in irreparable. But still, those challenges exist. The elusive. Yeah, the elusive single pane of glass Still Yeah, the elusive glass. And you have, you know, you have these, Uh, you have these environments, you have the, you know, so called infrastructure. As a service environments, you have AWS and Microsoft Azure as the classic examples. And basically, you know, that's the I'm gonna say bare metal. It's It's probably not the right term for this situation, but I'm gonna call a bare metal. You. You have this bare metal server. The server farms the cloud you can build upon, but you still need the expertise to build upon those and be able to integrate those. Then you have these higher level services. You know salesforce dot com, for example, has forced and they also offer, uh, they're offering. They're getting into the platform as a service environment as...

...well. Next week, there's another example. You know, they're offering ways to build upon their environment. So everybody's kind of getting into this game giving developers these tools to build within the specific domains. But you still need to be able to bring that all together. Yeah, what's in the complexity of the world where we stand today? Go in 2020 and 2021. What's a good way? Help enterprises as they're evolving, really identify the correct cloud platform for them. Obviously, nothing is 100% accurate or ah, 100% given. But what are some practical ways that they should be thinking to get to that? Yeah, correct cloud platform. You know, that's that's a tough one. Sometimes you have companies where every department sees a different cloud platform as its optimal platforms. You know, the marketing department, maybe see Salesforce and they want to build more upon salesforce. And what's going on there? Three. I t department may be using a W s. You know, other folks may be using azure, and, you know, I'm not sure if it's really a good idea to go with one single provider, one single platform. I think it's actually probably a a better idea to have this mix of environments thes thes competing or these different environments to provide more choices. I think what's happening now and what is really working to the advantage of companies is this choice. There's a lot of choices out there, and choice is a great thing. It really is a great thing. You don't wanna be relying on a single cloud vendor. You know, you know, AWS may have ah, credible array of services available and incredible tools. That's great, but we need those choices. We need that competition in the market, those offerings to move us forward and and to assure that we have a way to move applications where they're needed. You know, if we're not satisfied with the cost structure or the services being delivered by one cloud provider, we need to have that option. The shift to another cloud provider, I think, choices great, and and that's what we have now. And I think you know, it's great if it can stay in that state. So multi cloud and hybrid really is a good strategy going into 2021. Still, it really is. It really is, you know, and it starts with, you know, backup in recovery. For example, business continuity I've always said, you know, the ideal model would be if you're using the cloud for the bulk of the operations, it's great to be able to back up and restore from an on premises environment. And if you're focusing on premises, used the cloud as your backup and restore it, it's great to be able to use both. We move into more business centric applications, artificial intelligence where you need that capacity. You know, it'd be great to be able to leverage the capacity. The resource is off the best providers out there, you know, AWS provides Ah, huge storage capacity, for example, the store, all the data that big data you need for a I But there's other services. Uh, you know, Salesforce's Einstein that that provide were targeted ai type of functionality. Um, you know, you need that variety. You need that ability to choose. And, you know, I rued the day when you know we Seymour consolidation. You know, hopefully it won't go that way. Hopefully working to continue to see a dynamic marketplace with a lot of choice. Yeah, and I think that kind of add on to that trend to I think we've seen more and more announcements of one cloud provider being able to ingest data out of another cloud provider for a big data platform. And it seems like there's a lot Mawr interoperability taking place than there was before. So to some degree, you know, we see a lot of people saying our analysis paralysis, right? We don't know which Claude to go Thio Now I think you can kind of hedged a little bit and say, Well, if I end up in this storage mechanism from this cloud provider, this other cloud provider could still consume it. So I think it is taking a lot of that risk out of there as well. Decision, actually, and I think it's noteworthy was, well, that just about every software application provider out there... coming from the cloud. I mean, I don't think anybody buys new applications, uh, for on premise anymore, you know, on a CD or, ah, disco, whatever. It just wasn't happening where everybody is coming from the cloud. So, you know, if you use ah 100 applications in your enterprise, you may be using 100 different sources, a cloud based sources for your functionality, and that's okay, you know that that that works. So So we're sitting in kind of a hybrid, multi cloud world, and, you know, we talked about analysis, paralysis, and that's definitely a real thing. And so anybody going through that out there, that just that's normal just to understand that, But let's talk about some of the ways to identify the correct cloud platform for some specific applications and workloads. You know, what are some of the kind of decision matrix that take place and and kind of What is that mechanism that somebody can kind of go through to understand where the right landing place would be for those applications? I guess the defense where you're coming from, you know what kind of environment you're you're moving out of. If you've been a primarily an on premises environment with a large development team in house, you need to look at again that that that kind of a bare metal type of offering that I A s type of offering where you know you can continue your development work. You know, you probably a lot of proprietary applications or custom built applications. You need to move forward and you need that you just need that foundation that I s type of foundation that AWS or azure even Google Cloud provide to build on top of you know, it, it's called I passed environment, you know, uh, platform as a service where you have the database and the development tools and everything on on the cloud. And, uh so for that for that kind of environment where you have a development centric environment, you know, you need to look at these foundational type of environments, these foundational type of services. If you're perhaps a small to medium sized business and you know you don't have a huge I t. Department, um, you need to look at those types of services those types of providers that offer more back end service, more service in the back end. You know, such a salesforce, which provides a lot of that from the back end. You know it again. It depends on where you're coming from, where your company is coming from. And, you know, it should be said that a lot of these companies you have a lot of these companies with huge development department. They produce a lot of software, you know, the automakers for example, are becoming software companies. And, you know, you've heard it said before that every company is now becoming a software company, and I think to a degree in the process, every company is also becoming a cloud provider in its own right. You know, you have a financial service company, for example, that that puts APS out there and the APS to ride services essentially there. You know, they're probably leveraging back in cloud services, but they're providing a service, a SAS or ah, cloud based service to their customer base, You know, through APS or uh, through through mobile Web or or whatever. You know, it's, you know, they don't call a cloud, you know, you make, you know, you have may have insurance provider that's providing these interfaces to its partners, you know, so that they could see, uh, what the rate schedules are and things like that. But they're not gonna call the cloud service, you know, they're just za partner network or, uh, in exchange or something of that, right? Yeah, I think you'll see to your point, it's funny. We were just meeting with our CEO a couple weeks back and talking about EJ, you know, the more core and edge stuff and that that will drive. I think it'll be symbiotic of one another, or one will drive the other vice versa, you know, But that that we'll see a lot of that play out as companies become mawr shared ownership of data. You know, they're not in the business of data collection. They don't want the risk. They wanna move it somewhere else. But yet they want the data. All that kind of stuff is Well, so yeah, well said, Yeah, and the internet of things is really throwing. This whole thing opens. Well, we have all the data coming in from your partners and good point there.

Who owns the data? You know, you know, if an auto company has a sensor, if if an insurance company rather has sensors that are planted within autos, who owns that data is the driver is the insurance company. Is that the automaker? There's a lot about things I need to be hashed out with. That with your compliance way talk a lot about compliance around here. It's only going to get more complicated as this industry of all that is for sure. Yeah. Yeah, And I saw formula once. Uh, I was on some online somewhere where you calculated the worth of your data. Like your personal data. How much is that worth on the market? I think mine came to, like $8.25 or something. Z, uh, low risk, lower. Uh, it's interesting. It's interesting times in that regard. How if we take a step back and we look at the cloud providers today AWS Azure, G C P. What are some highlight benefits from your perspective that you've seen out there you've written about? You've provided some commentary? Um, yeah, benefits of each cloud provider are there, you know, benefits of one over another, not tow, not toe pit, one against the other. But when you see some quick winds, especially in the enterprise, why one would stand out as opposed to another one? Well, um, you know, a Ws really has had a lot of the attention and a lot of the pioneering work. I guess you could say in the cloud space has been coming out of AWS. They've been in this space since, uh, I'm gonna say 2000 and 4. 2005. They kind of pioneered the whole concept of moving out of the data center and relying on servers and virtual service, if you will, from from another source from the cloud. And they've been really taking the lead with with pioneering different concepts, they've you know lately they've moved to ah, concept called outpost, where, you know, if you if you need late and see if you're not close enough to an AWS data center, you need that late and see you can amplify the signal, if you will, you know they'll bring in a little not a little, but they'll bring in a rack of service for you and the service act as, ah, local cloud that accesses, uh, also AWS has the pioneering. The innovators edge Microsoft Azure is an advantage because everybody has Windows Windows Server on side. They have ah, sequel server databases. They have, ah, Microsoft centric development environments. So Aziz is easy to plug into these environments. You know, there's, ah, the Windows 3 65 Microsoft 3 65 services as well. That has that include word and the productivity applications. Which kind of tying the sure, but not quite. But you know the very similar type of concept you know, you have these. Everybody in the world is just about every company in the world for the past 2030 years has been a Microsoft centric environment. To some degree. Ondas, you're kind of float into that so that you have that advantage there. G c p. You know Google, Of course, as with, Amazon is a real innovator, and, uh, they have the cost advantage. Typically, Google services have been, uh, free or close to free for many applications and many uses. And, uh, you know, they have. They have that cost advantage as well as being highly innovative type of environment. So among those three, you know, it's, uh, some some interesting choices. Sure. Thank you for that. I wanna challenge question for you. Not not to be too hard, but so does the S o. A manifesto still stand across. Doesn't matter which cloud you are, or that's a great question. USO, a service oriented architecture has been around for some time. It z people don't talk about it as much. It's kind of just kind of...

...blended into the woodwork, blended into the foundation of things We formulated the S o a manifesto with Thomas Earl took the lead. Thomas Earl of our I'm gonna mangle the pronunciation are key to, uh, education. He's based on Vancouver. He's been he's been a lot of books and he pioneered the the idea of constructing and manifest very similar to the agile manifesto. You see a lot of similarities between the two. We met in Rotterdam back in 2009 and came up with these concepts. We had just about every major vendor a swell, some problem. The analyst involved with the formulation of the principles. And I think, for the most part, the principles still saying justice, the agile manifesto, those principles still stand And basically what the S O a manifesto says is, you know, don't build your i t as a monolith. You know the I T. Needs to be responsive to the business. It needs to be more granular. You need thio build as the business you need to grow your i t with the business and stay close to the business and stay focused on what the business needs. I think yes, so manifesto is, uh, foundation of cloud. It's basically cloud is s o A commercialized e would agree. I feel like we get lost sometimes. And we let the cool features and stuff drive. You know, our decisions where we need to go back and let the business drive. What? We make the decisions as opposed to the feature set driving, uh, you know, better decision or whatever. You know that, but But I like that s a manifesto. Certainly. Uh, still stands the test of time here in the cloud world. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's great. So, Joe, going into, you know, we're going into 2021 at this point. And you obviously, you're out there doing a lot of research, talking to a lot of people. What are some of the trends that you're seeing there gonna either continue develop or anything else with any predictions that you like to share with us today? Okay, well, for those listening, we did this. We did this session here at the end of 2020 late December 2020. So we're wrapping up 2020. And what a what a year It's been a year it's been And, uh, for the i t industry, you know, it's been actually ah, very. It's been a very forward looking year for the I T industry. You know, we talked a lot about digital transformation. We've been talking about digital transformation for a decade now, and it's always been something that's been a little bit futuristic. You know, companies still have a lot of manual processes. Companies still have a lot of legacy infrastructure. Still a lot of work they need to do in terms of corporate culture and adapting to the new environment. All of a sudden, in the spring of 2020 like that, it's like, You know, if you're not digital, if you're not residing on the cloud, you're not gonna be able to keep up with things. You're not gonna be able to survive the impact of Kobe, which is basically every company, every employee, every knowledge worker. I should say I need to clarify that every knowledge worker that's in an office was scattered among the diaspora. This corporate diaspora, if you will across their homes worldwide. It's a global pandemic, of course, and it's a worldwide phenomena. This this really was the ultimate test for the cloud. It was the ultimate test for digital capabilities. The ultimate test for the cloud and and the fact that at this point it's fortunate that a lot of companies were running on the cloud or relying on cloud services, which were uninterrupted. No, Kobe could not interrupt the performance. The services delivered by the cloud. You know, there was capacity issues, of course, with local networks around neighborhoods. You know, where people are working out their houses and so forth Glitches like that. But nothing major really...

...interfered with the performance of business. Um, the cloud being on the cloud really pulled a lot of businesses through this crisis. It's been really interesting to watch, you know, in terms of disaster recovery, business continuity, working virtually. You know, if Kobe that struck 10 years ago, it would have been entirely different story. You know, we would economy would have been in a lot of trouble. Um, and we're gonna see that going forward looking, looking forward in the 2021 you know? You know, hopefully, the things they're going to clear up and this nasty viruses gonna become history sooner than better sooner than later. But we're going to continue to see virtual work. We're gonna really be accelerate continue to accelerate in the cloud. We're gonna continue Thio, move forward with digital and I've been calling it You may have seen some of my posts. I've been calling this phenomenon the contact lists organization. You know, we talked about contact lists, commerce and contact list shopping, and that's been the requirement that's been needed. On Bet's we're seeing now is a contact list organization where you can work virtually you can tap into all these resource is across the globe. You know, Cloud based resource is people. Resource is and doesn't matter where people reside anymore. It Zaveri global phenomenon and it's been it's been interesting to watch, and we're going to see that develop. Yeah, and just a little footnote to that when we talk about virtual work, full time virtual work. I don't think it's a great thing for anybody under 35. E. Don't think anything for anybody. Starting the career we need. We need to have people be able to go into offices and interact with each other and develop mentor relationships and things of that sort. But otherwise it za great thing. Virtual work is a great thing, you know, you just need to have that hybrid mix. Plus, if you're under 35 you might have some toddlers running around as well. E O E o. Well, very good, Joe. Really. Thank you for your time today. Great insights that you have provided to our audience. We really appreciate that. Skip. Always good to see you and talk to you as usual. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Skip. Thank you. And that's been great to be here with you. Absolutely. Thank you, everybody, for listening. And, as always, for comments, suggestions and ideas, please. Email is that cloud crunch at second watch dot com? You've been listening to Cloud Crunch with Ian Willoughby and Skip Very. For more information, check out the blogged. Second watch dot com slash company slash block or reach out to second watch on Twitter.

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